Does your God love violence, mindlessness, or making you very confused when it comes to time?
Muslims and Christians have
thinking that’s twisted?
Jesus, Muhammad, both
never existed
According to many
historical types
Who say the accounts are
hysterical hypes.
While others indignantly
claim there to be
Quite considerably more
historicity
For both than supporting
all those who will state
There was a real bloke:
Alexander the Great.
‘Did!’ ‘Didn’t!’ ‘Is!’ ‘Isn’t!’
sums up the debate,
Where logical thinking
is not very great,
And leads to conclusion
which one has to face,
That neither opinion
has proven its case.
Some people believe in
ancestors and spooks
Supported by numerous
very old books;
And this can no more be
disproven nor proved
Than those with opinions
more mainstream-ly grooved.
The Great God Smogwobble,
constructed of smoke,
Would be, come to think of it,
less of a joke
Than concepts today quite
devoutly believed
Instead of with utter
derision received.
But whether or not there’s
a god up on high,
Or whether it boils down
to pie in the sky,
An inner conviction,
which deep thought brings out,
Is surely the best to
resolve any doubt.
With maths and with science
one’s able to plot
Quite accurately how
everything has now got
To stage it is at,
but no answer comes by
To answer the question,
not how, but just: why?
All natural laws, all
things dead or alive,
Do demonstrate purpose,
direction, and drive;
Conclusions that no master
plan there can be
Are thus quite the height of
crass idiocy?
Colonialist's Blog 
excellent post and interesting, common sense approach, Sir… admiration & respect, Mélanie – convinced Darwinian-Cartesian 🙂
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Thank you – I see your Mirror post would bring in the Euclidean variation of the Cartesian Plane! Putting Descartes before the horse? 🙂
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People just need to respect each other’s beliefs, something that I don’t think has happened since the beginning of time
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Mind you, some of the more absurd ones are incredibly hard to respect!
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I totally agree with you, Mon Colonel…
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Brilliantly written! 😀
According to some natural scientists, (ok, animal ethologists and biologists) the question “why” is misplaced. At least if you are looking for a purpose-why rather than a causal why. It seems to strive towards a goal, and funnily it always, in retrospect, arrives at a goal – but the goal it arrives at, was that actually predictable? According to them, no, which renders the question for a purpose… purposeless.
Ok I can’t go into much detail because I don’t know enough, but e.g. in the genetic evolution of certain plants, I could point to certain patterns. The patterns are a constant balancing act between improving specific adaptations to a given environment, and remaining unspecific enough that, should there be a sudden environmental shift, the species isn’t in a dead-end. Typically, if a plant adjusts perfectly to a cold environment such as high up in some mountains, and a few of its members are carried off (e.g. in a river) to warmer areas and stranded, the fully adapted plant will not be able to grow there, whereas a more generalized relative will.
So the “purpose” of being the perfect mountain plant is not really a purpose but an over time, trial and error adaptation that must not become too perfect for the species to survive across time or environments.
Nevertheless the same natural scientists see the very life force that causes the plants and their adaptations, as the Divine. There need not be a humanoid, brain-devised plan for this energy to be divine. To paraphrase one of them (I believe it was Lorenz): It would be a poor watchmaker who would have to keep readjusting his creation all the time.
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The point largely missed is that the inherent striving of everything from microbes to man indicates that there is something to be gained on a macrocosmic level from the microcosmic urge. Things don’t remain static – some retrogress, but in the main there is an urge towards improvement (although mankind seems on a downward spiral at the moment). This is where the ‘why’ comes in. The Divine, whether a part of everything or a separate `creator` does seem to have a purpose in mind – even if it is just a sophisticated cosmic watch!
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Wow! Where do I begin? First, I applaud you–no easy take to take on religion–especially in such clever verse. So many struck me as I read this.
1. You can’t offer proof for a belief, though many try (thus the frustration)!
2. Even science (the supposedly last word on objective , solid fact has reversed itself on many occasions over time.
3. People can contemplate the mysteries of life, death, and meaning of their existence, so they do. Different cultures come up with different answers to these puzzling questions (thus faith systems emerge out of our universal human need to have answers). What makes these faith systems different is the answers we come up with, not the human origin of them. (That’s my sociology training kicking in). So all this fighting over who is “right” and who is “wrong” is senseless> We all just want answers and came up with different ones that suited us. It’s like adapting to different environments. It’s not wrong that people from hot climates adapted their clothing and food to hot climates while people from cold climates adapted their clothing and food to cold climates. They just did and that makes them different, not wrong! Why can’t people see that religion is the same thing? I suppose because we are convinced that religion is not “of” us but “above” us. But without people, there would be no religion…
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I must agree on all points.
It really boils down to seriously flawed people trying to ascribe their god as having the same flaws.
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Well said!
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Celever as always Col 🌸
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Thanks – but this one is not trying so much to be clever as to make serious points. I genuinely can’t understand how people intelligent enough to understand complex scientific and mathematical theories are so closed when it comes to the most important field of all enquiry.
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One word is in my mind..FAITH!,,,,No proof is asked , nor is it needed…My heart tells me all that I need to know, but I can understand others for believing in other thoughts.
One thing has always puzzled me….war, cruelty, destruction, killing, harming others…why would my God let these things happen
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Faith is the inner conviction I referred to, but it should not be divorced from reasoning. The mixture of what in human terms are good and evil, joy and tragedy, is all part of the structure, Who knows that they can be viewed from quite the same personal perspective in universal terms? Faith should be accepting all that happens as part of an overall plan towards ‘good’ for everything that exists.
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I’ve had discussions on this particular item with people of all sorts of beliefs. Some believe that bad things happen because of karmic payback and karmic contracts. E.g. a little baby gets abused to death – why??? The Atheist will take this as proof that there cannot be a god. The Christian will say it’s the doing of Satan. Some New Agers, and also some of the Far Eastern religions, have the concept that in a previous life, the baby was actually the abuser, and is now suffering its punishment. (Logical objection to this: Such a “contract” could go on forever and ever…? Isn’t the Karmic Wheel of reincarnation supposed to give us the opportunity to improve with each lifetime until we’re mature enough to escape it?)
My personal 2-pennies on this: There are two possibilities. Either there is karmic sense in this – in which case it actually was the poor baby’s experiential life path, for whatever reason (cruel universe theory), and one then seriously hopes for reincarnation so that she can experience something better the next time, or at least a halcyon paradise after death – or it really is only the pointless, predatory style violence that is endemic to this planet, and humankind still needs many more centuries of hanging criminals before we can call ourselves “evolved”.
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The atheists crow triumphantly that reincarnation is an impossibility due simply to the numbers now living as opposed to the numbers known to have lived over the ages. The reincarnationists counter this with a ‘new soul’ theory (I know a lot of people dim enough to qualify) and that all souls do not necessarily come from Earth.
So souls need to progress? The Karmic theory still goes nowhere much towards a satisfactory answer as to ‘why?’.
My own feeling is that any theory holding that humans are a special case is flawed. The universe as a whole is what is progressing. Again, WHY?
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I agree re the humanocentric viewpoint. Re new souls: Well, while we’re on the topic of parapsychology anyway, anything is possible in these realms. 😀 But it wouldn’t even be necessary, if you’d consider including every living being into the karmic equation. There are many, many exponentially more ants, for instance, than humans could ever dream to be; and that’s just one insect species. Also, from that angle, whole species have gone extinct (never mind; whole 54% of all life on Earth in the largest of the mass extinctions so far) – where did their souls go?
I think the more pertinent question if one followed that philosophical path, would be where all these souls came from (if the numbers have to remain constant)? Or is it more like in an electron cloud, where a “single” electron can materialize here or there, but mainly the “cloud” is dispersed? (LOL – you realize we’re now in the modern equivalent of the discussion of how many angels can dance on the tip of a needle.)
Do souls need to progress? Well according to the Buddhistic viewpoint (if I understood this correctly), they ought to try to progress, or else be doomed to reincarnate forever. The Buddhist “Nirvana” as a place of 100% sensory deprivation, a state of “nothingness”, has always spooked me a bit, so I’m sort-of certain I misunderstand some of the concepts here. To me, a place of “nothing and nowhere” would be the only genuine concept I could come up with to “Hell”. Luckily, even interstellar space is filled with star dust, interstellar clouds and “plasma”.
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I must say that I don’t go with the Buddhist buddies on ambitions to go into nil, zero and zilch. I’d prefer to go on re-petunia-ing, thanks very much!
Anyway, that’s still absolutely no answer to life, the universe and everything that makes any sense.
Space – yes, not to mention dark matter, and quantum dimensions!
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😀 This conversation is getting spacier by the minute… and you’re quite right, it doesn’t answer the “why”.
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https://vivinfrance.wordpress.com/2012/04/16/warum/ on the same lines.
PS I love that last cartoon.
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‘Warum’, indeed. Very good about bad.
The last cartoon is a classic, indeed. Extremely clever.
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Excellent post!
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Reblogged this on tweetlessblogmore and commented:
Very true and legit questioning to the hyper-religious and even to atheists-
This post is for those who truly welcome ideas and question just about everything- love this!
Cheers to those who fall somewhere in between the extremes 🍻
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Thanks for reblogging – I hope it stimulates some grey matter activity!
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It has for me anyway and the people that I am friends with on here would agree too! Maybe not the ones I live around and interact with in “real life” but who cares- this blog is for me and I’m enjoying posts like this! 😎
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Extremely clever verse. And I was cheering all the way til the last verse. Though I am so glad you included the question mark 😉
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Thanks.
Re the last part, I genuinely can’t understand why that point isn’t simply taken as a QED. I mean, everything that happens points straight to it.
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*Wags finger* Oh no you don’t, Mister N.
It’s too late … 🙂
Maybe tomorrow.
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Maybe. It has occurred to me it requires the same sort of mind shift as one has when deciding that ‘gospel truth’ is largely a lot of hogwash.
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Ditto over here!
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But, why?
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Masterpiece!
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Delighted you regard it as such … er, that wasn’t irony, was it? 🙂
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That last cartoon is funny. I’m still working on the Buddhist one … I should probably be asleep.
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Buddhists love to empty the mind by going into a meditative trance. I’m still not sure why.
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This idiot does not ascribe to a master, monster, messed-up, or any other type of plan.
“why” is an overrated question, in my opinion, and one that ultimately detract from the experience of this life (again, my opinion).
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I have a diametrically opposite view, in feeling that if there is a reasonable idea that everything actually means something, the experience of living becomes far more exciting.
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I know . . . but if we discussed it again, I’ll end up leaving. I think we’ll just let this one be.
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Amen – er, so be it.
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Again, ditto on that one!
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Why, again? Afraid of answers? 🙂
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